Posts by JonnyShogun

33 posts
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JonnyShogun says


What the…? The theme options panel in a plugin? Really? The theme options are related to only that specific theme, not to any other, so what’s the point in having it in a plugin? WTF?
Theme Options will stay on your theme. Shortcodes, CPTs and Metaboxes are moving to a plugin.

I am still waiting on a definitive answer from JAPH and ENVATO SUPPORT, since when i emailed support about option panels, they told me: that ALL functionality that is NOT core, must be ported to a plugin for the Phase 2 starting in November. JAPH asked for my Support Ticket ID so he can investigate this. So i am still waiting on clarification from JAPH and ENVATO SUPPORT STAFF on the confusion since we are being told different things on the forum and through Envato support tickets. Hopefully we get an answer soon. :)

33 posts
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JonnyShogun says

Hey everyone, I hope the following responses help provide some clarifications.

If I missed your question, or my response is actually more confusing than clarifying, I apologise and will happily clarify further.

Again, I apologise for the long reply, and the long wait, I didn’t expect 6 pages! ;)


Im not just randomly saying this. The reason i said that my slider options and theme options need to go in a plugin, in Phase 2 starting in November, is because that’s the answer Enavto Support gave me TODAY when i emailed them about it. They said they will be requiring all functionality, even theme and slider options and pages ported to a plugin. Thats what they told me. So thats what im going by!

Can you please provide me with the support ticket ID on this so I can clarify?

Hello, my ticket is: Ticket ID: KVR-513-21114

I asked several times.. and I was told that all functionality that is not core must go in a plugin for Phase 2 starting in Novemeber.

thanks again if you can clear this up JAPH :)

33 posts
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JonnyShogun says



Suppose that I have one plugin that can handle all the functionallity, however when it is activated nothing shows, because I must initiate parts of it somewhere. Now the question I want to know if this is allowed, to init these parts inside my theme or I must create another plugin for this(let’s say “Theme Functions”).
Example:
Plugin Core: contains multiple PHP classes.
class My_Metabox {...}
class My_theme_Options{...}
class My_CPT{...}

Theme: Init these classes inside my theme so when the user activate my theme and if the plugin(Plugin Core) is activated it will show the options required for this particular theme:

if(class_exists('My_Metabox ') ) {
    $meta_options = array(
        //all options for my metaboxes
    )
    new My_Metabox($meta_options);
}
//A similar call for other classes: My_theme_Options, My_CPT, etc.
...

So, is allowed to do such calls from theme?
It should be, that’s how I’m doing it too.

So if a user installs and activates your theme and plugin and everything works fine, then switches to new theme, your plugin metaboxes and CPT no longer show? Is this the general idea?

If so, doesn’t that defeat purpose of making it a plugin to begin with? Plugin idea is to allow user to access the information no matter what theme they use. I think it should always show in backend, but maybe not do anything or not look good on the frontend if the plugin is activated on a theme you didn’t create it for.

Maybe I misunderstand what you mean.

@teamCrisis</srong> Your missing the point of making the custom functionality in themes into a plugin. Its not to allow ALL your functionality in your theme to be available to other themes. The STAFF and SUPPORT have said that its to separate the custom functionality you add to the theme, from the core. It is to also make sure that when a user switches to a different theme, that the content doesn’t break because of shortcodes and custom post types for the content and data.

So we are still waiting on clarification from STAFF and SUPPORT, if theme specific options (Like Slider options and Theme options) that are made into plugins, that don’t affect content and data will be allowed to have a theme check, to only be available to our theme. While still keeping all the users content and shortcodes intact.

33 posts
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JonnyShogun says


Im not just randomly saying this. The reason i said that my slider options and theme options need to go in a plugin, in Phase 2 starting in November, is because that’s the answer Enavto Support gave me TODAY when i emailed them about it. They said they will be requiring all functionality, even theme and slider options and pages ported to a plugin. Thats what they told me. So thats what im going by!

Why in earlier post today you say:

There has been no clarification from STAFF or JAPH regarding other functionality in plugin that have to work 100% on another themes frontend. They have only specified custom post types, shortcodes, and widgets.
and then you say:
because that’s the answer Enavto Support gave me TODAY when i emailed them about it. They said they will be requiring all functionality, even theme and slider options and pages ported to a plugin. Thats what they told me. So thats what im going by!

Maybe I’m confused or maybe you confusing others, but it seems Envato gave you concrete answer about it, right? So I don’t understand what issue you have. It seems Evanto want all functionality, including sliders to be plugin.

That said, I don’t know how Envato will handle licensing issues with plugins such as Layer Slider who state you cannot distribute their wp plugins in your theme as a plugin. It must be in theme itself.

Envato staff, can you please make public comment on this slider discrepancy?

Because that was BEFORE i got the email today from ENVATO Support, in response to my question regarding this. So i commented here once i received that response from ENVATO Support, so others would know what they said to me. I even asked them to clarify more, and I will be posting their reply here again, when they clarify further regarding this. So please read my comment fully before saying i said this and that.

33 posts
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JonnyShogun says


When i say deactivate the plugin im talking about having 2 plugins.. one with functionality specific to the theme that does NOT affect content globally, even if the theme is switched out. And a second plugin having all shortcodes, custom post types and widgets remaining ACTIVE so when the theme is switched out it doesn’t break the content.

The point of the plugin is not to use it in other themes, its so when the user wants to switch themes they don’t have their content and data affected. Im talking about another plugin that has my admin options and slider options in a plugin, that wont affect content since the slider options and theme options are specific to my theme. And are only put in a plugin to separate my custom code in the theme per Enavatos new guidelines for Phase 2 in November.

Because i asked Enavto Support and they said that porting to plugin was to separate WordPress functionality from my custom functionality, so its separate. Which is part of Phase 2 in November. The point of the porting functionality to a plugin, is not to make so it can be used on other themes, but to keep the content from breaking when users switch themes.

I don’t think I understand your theme idea. Why if your “plugins” rely on options panel do you need them to be in a plugin? It seems they only work at all if your theme option panel is active, which means it is only theme specific, right? Therefore, I don’t see why you need them as plugins.

Maybe:

1. Envato simply didn’t understand your set up and gave you wrong answer, or

2. Maybe your set up is complex and not best for end user and you should think of simplify it. Why do you need such information in option panel when it can be in one place in plugin? I think this is the general idea Japh was conveying to you in earlier post. Why make user go to two places to perform one functionality? What does it serve to have such information in option panel instead of all in simple plugin?

3. I don’t know about your slider. I think Staff said in earlier post they need to review ideas about slider and whether they need to be plugin or can remain in theme. I think there are issues regarding licensing if you buy slider from CC that go against new requirements Envato set. I think you have to want for concrete answer from Envato about slider.

Im not just randomly saying this. The reason i said that my slider options and theme options need to go in a plugin, in Phase 2 starting in November, is because that’s the answer Enavto Support gave me TODAY when i emailed them about it. They said they will be requiring all functionality, even theme and slider options and pages ported to a plugin. Thats what they told me. So thats what im going by!

33 posts
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JonnyShogun says





—if we are using the TGMAC, can we set the plugin to force deactivate if the user switches the theme so are plugin is only used with our theme? (with the exception of shortcodes)
You can put in a theme info check inside plugins to only work with a certain theme or you could also use a purchase key check or something. – don’t know if thats allowed btw. Waiting for response for that in an earlier question.
I very much doubt this would ever be allowed. That defeats the entire purpose of putting various functionality into a plugin in the first place. Nice idea, but again, very much unlikely to be allowed.

The whole point to put it in a plugin, is not so its available to other themes. Its so the content doesn’t break with custom post types and shortcodes when the theme is switched.

ThemeForest wants your custom code separated from wordpress functionality which starts in Phase 2 in November. @teamCrisis So to say it wont be allowed (to deactivate portions of the plugin, when some features ported to the plugin wont effect the content globally) is speculation at best. Im gonna wait to see what STAFF and SUPPORT says!

Maybe I don’t Understand you. English is not my first language. But I was quoting ChapterTheme’s comment about “put in a theme info check inside plugins to only work with a certain theme”. This is what I refer to when I say this is probably not allowed as it will defeat the purpose of a plugin in the first place.

In any case, your idea of deactivate should be okay as long as you allow the user to reactivate the plugin in the new theme. ChapterTheme’s idea, if I understand correctly, seems to be a way to circumvent Envato guidelines in order to prevent easy unauthorized use of plugin. I’m not sure how it would work anyway. Probably a small change in plugin code would allow it to work on any theme anyway.

When i say deactivate the plugin im talking about having 2 plugins.. one with functionality specific to the theme that does NOT affect content globally, even if the theme is switched out. And a second plugin having all shortcodes, custom post types and widgets remaining ACTIVE so when the theme is switched out it doesn’t break the content.

The point of the plugin is not to use it in other themes, its so when the user wants to switch themes they don’t have their content and data affected. Im talking about another plugin that has my admin options and slider options in a plugin, that wont affect content since the slider options and theme options are specific to my theme. And are only put in a plugin to separate my custom code in the theme per Enavatos new guidelines for Phase 2 in November.

Because i asked Enavto Support and they said that porting to plugin was to separate WordPress functionality from my custom functionality, so its separate. Which is part of Phase 2 in November. The point of the porting functionality to a plugin, is not to make so it can be used on other themes, but to keep the content from breaking when users switch themes.

33 posts
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JonnyShogun says



—if we are using the TGMAC, can we set the plugin to force deactivate if the user switches the theme so are plugin is only used with our theme? (with the exception of shortcodes)
You can put in a theme info check inside plugins to only work with a certain theme or you could also use a purchase key check or something. – don’t know if thats allowed btw. Waiting for response for that in an earlier question.
I very much doubt this would ever be allowed. That defeats the entire purpose of putting various functionality into a plugin in the first place. Nice idea, but again, very much unlikely to be allowed.

The whole point to put it in a plugin, is not so its available to other themes. Its so the content doesn’t break with custom post types and shortcodes when the theme is switched.

ThemeForest wants your custom code separated from wordpress functionality which starts in Phase 2 in November. @teamCrisis So to say it wont be allowed (to deactivate portions of the plugin, when some features ported to the plugin wont effect the content globally) is speculation at best. Im gonna wait to see what STAFF and SUPPORT says!

33 posts
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JonnyShogun says

@Theme-Desert, maybe I was not clear the first time. Let me give it another shot. So, you’re saying…
Im just saying that by making all functionality into a plugin for things like slider options, widgets.. just makes it easier for someone to steal your code

Why should you receive extra compensation if a user decides to use your plugin in another theme? Did the user pay for the initial package? Yes. Does he use more than one copies of it if he bought a regular licence? No. Did he pay extra for that plugin? You’re damn right he did! He paid on average $45 to $60 compared to $30-$35, a simple theme’s price. So how’s the extra $15 to $30 as compensation for your plugin? Sounds good to me.

The only difference here my friend is that THE USER pays the whole amount in just one place: ThemeForest for $55, instead of buying your simple theme (or as some like to call it – skin – though it’s the same thing no matter how pompous you want to make it sound) from ThemeForest for $35 and your plugin from CodeCanyon for $20.

You get compensation.

@QBKL I understand there are ways to get the code. And I never said that, its an extra $15 to $30 as compensation for your plugin? Your missing my question!

Why would i make a simple theme and then require a user to go searching around codecanyon to buy bits and pieces of functionality through a plugin. Most users want it all in one theme, they don’t want to go fishing around making a theme like a Mr Potato Head..

Even all the Elite authors will eventually have to port all thier functionality to a super plugin. But all this is still up in the air and we need better clarification, instead of non STAFF members making their assumptions on how it should be done.

There has been no clarification from STAFF or JAPH regarding other functionality in plugin that have to work 100% on another themes frontend. They have only specified custom post types, shortcodes, and widgets.

As far as compensation im talking about the theme prices would need to go up since im selling a theme with functionality that is no longer specific to my theme but is available to other themes as well. So that becomes a problem since now you have to sell the theme on themeforest, and then possibly your plugins for your theme on codecanyon.

All this plugin nonsense will be fine if ThemeForest Staff say we are allowed to deactivate our theme specific plugins (with the exception of shortcodes), when the Theme is switched/changed.

33 posts
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JonnyShogun says

1. “we are now becoming plugin developers”. Haven’t you been a developer already!? Just because you move PHP code from theme to a plugin that has a definition, activation and deactivation hooks makes you any different. That’s just a wrong, wrong perception.
2. “will get no compensation”. Last time I checked, feature jam-packed themes sold for more than regular, simpler themes. This means… what does it mean? Compensation.

i know the difference between developing themes and plugins. I can understand shortcodes being made into a plugin. Im just saying that by making all functionality into a plugin for things like slider options, widgets.. just makes it easier for someone to steal your code since they don’t have to search through your whole theme. Now its in a plugin, and easy pickings.

When i talk about compensation.. im talking about compensation for your theme specific plugin being used in another theme. I understand separating our functionality into a plugin for our theme but i don’t see the purpose of having it available to be used in other themes when it was created to be used with just your theme. With the exception of shortcoodes, so the content doesn’t break when the theme is switched, which was the main reason all this plugin stuff started anyway.

33 posts
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JonnyShogun says

It looks like a lot of people on this discussion are worried like i am regarding having to make everything into a plugin. And then having the plugins be an issue due to the following reasons.

  • Code in a plugin will be portable and easier to steal. What protects us from this misue?
  • Since its a plugin, are we responsible for the plugin working in other themes? (with the exception of shortcodes markup staying intact)
  • If a user switches themes, some functionality wont be on the theme they switched to because all the js, css supporting it will be in our theme?
  • How do we update the plugin, with a new theme update, tell the user to upload the new files into the plugins directory?
  • If we are using the TGMAC, can we set the plugin to force deactivate if the user switches the theme so are plugin is only used with our theme? (with the exception of shortcodes)
  • So now it seems we are now becoming plugin developers and will get no compensation since the plugins we make that are specific to our theme, will now be used in other developers theme. And we will have users who buy our theme, why someone else’s theme plugin is not working in our theme.

This will be a problem !!

Any help from STAFF and/or JAPH will be highly appreciated :)

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