Posts by chrisatlemon

1052 posts
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chrisatlemon
says

@lumberjack: I have a person who gave me a two star rating on my file because it’s a PSD. He wrote to me by mail stating that he saw it’s a PSD but thought it should also be INDD.

So despite knowing what he was buying he was still unhappy and rated me down.

Go figure…

Cheers

Chris

1052 posts
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chrisatlemon
says

While I do think that the overall visual quality is okay I think there’s too much “in between” here.

My first thought was the same as lumberjack: NBC. It’s only after looking closer that I saw it’s not actually as similar as it seems at first sight. However that first look may be quite important.

Then: I don’t think there is quite enough there for it to be a corporate ID package. Have a look at a couple of my latest submission and look at how money documents, variations and additional files I include. I’m not saying that it’s the only or the right way to go, but I’m sure that if you added invoices, purchase order, compliment slips et cetera you would have a more complete package. The way it is now, I find it lacking a little.

If it was only a letterhead then again, there’s not really a letterhead there.

So I think the problem is not necessary the quality of the item. I have a feeling that it doesn’t really meet either just letterhead or full corporate ID completely.

I can’t guarantee that’s it, but it’s the feeling I get when looking at what’s on offer. I think that would definitely have merited some advice though, not just a hard reject.

Cheers

Chris.

1052 posts
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chrisatlemon
says

Yup – it’s not always consistent. I have a bifold and a trifold which are essentially the exact same only in different layouts. One is priced at $8 the other is priced at $10 :)

I tend to figure that if it’s cheaper maybe it’ll sell more :)

If you want to do quality and creative art, then you should. Why don’t you divide your time between projects you enjoy and projects that will sell. I really enjoy corporate IDs and stationary because I can design the entire look of a company, create something which for me is rewarding and meaningful. But these are also very time intensive. So from time to time I also do a flyer or a trifold which I can do in a couple of days and may get a few extra sales on.

Cheers

Chris

1052 posts
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chrisatlemon
says

hi Golden,

I understand your frustration..

Pricing is solely made on the category you submit to and the flexibility your item permits.

My stationery items always get the same price, and they always get the same price as any other item in my category.

All my items are totally unique. I include a huge amount of variations, file types, branding assets, vectors, et cetera to complement my corporate ID and stationery items.

Yet they are the same price as other authors item will basically just reuse the same material and paste in a new header and footer.

Even compared to my own items: my earlier items were quite simple. My later items are quite elaborate. The difference is weeks of work. My latest item took a full six weeks to finish. Nevertheless they all have the same price.

So the extra effort is not compensated in pricing. The only thing that gets considered when fixing the price is the category you post in and the flexibility your file allows.

A mockup of a Mac screen will not yield you more than five dollars. No matter how many variations you include.

if you decide to put in the extra effort, the extra attention to detail, include file type conversions, include more flexibility, include many variations: you do this for your own pride and because you want to offer a more complete product to your customers. You do not do it because you will be better compensated.

Frustrating, but that’s how it is. But you will also see that those authors who include less attention to detail and less variations will also make less sales. That still doesn’t warrant the same price, but that’s just how this market works.

If you are in for the money, you’re better off doing four or five less detailed, less complete and less quality items then putting more effort into providing one premium item.

Through their pricing guidelines Envato also tell us that that is what they want. If they didn’t, they would compensate more effort with higher pricing. But they don’t.

Cheers

Chris

1052 posts
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chrisatlemon
says

Sales are declining slowly over time. More and more items, more competition and items sell less as they get older.

In my experience you need to keep adding files just to keep your sales volume.

To increase you need to add at a faster pace than your older items stop selling.

This market functions on many new items quickly , not few quality items regularly.. Of course if you are a wizard and cann add many quality items quickly, then you’re on a winner :)

Cheers

Chris

1052 posts
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chrisatlemon
says

@Nico: frankly, I am a pretty polite person. And I offer advice for “newbies” because I value that I was helped here as a newbie, too. But honestly, I don’t have time to sugarcoat it. I have a very demanding day job and everything I do here I do in what little spare time I have. GR is my hobby.

So if I offend someone because I’m telling them their typography is off, really, that is their problem. Don’t ask for advice if you don’t want to hear it. Or if you only want to hear that reviewers are clueless. Or that it’s all so unfair. Or that everybody has a right to sell here. You won’t hear that from me.

You know that I disagree with many things here at Envato. I’ve been fighting it out with support all week because I thought I was treated without due respect, and I’m strill not happy about it.

But if a logo is not up to scratch, I will say that, too!

In any case, I think you read too much into what I say: I don’t have time or motivation to offend anyone here. I just put my two cents into the conversation.

Cheers

Chris

1052 posts
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chrisatlemon
says

@Nico – easy Nico, it’s all good :) I just feel that everytime anyone is trying provide a little feedback or advice here we get an allergic reaction as opposed to taking up the input.

It’s the same with authors in the items forum: they ask why their item got rejected, and when you offer advice what you get back is a sh!tstorm about how no-one understands how great their item is.

I just thought it was great thast a customer feeds back to us what he needs and thought that instead or moaning about it to him we should be grateful – whether we then decide to take up his input or not.

I’m not saying to blindly follow it, no-one asked that. I just think any input from a customer is valuable.

I’d love to have input on all my items from all potential customers. That doesn’t mean I will do anything, but it will mean I know what the customer is looking for. I would find that invaluable.

Have a nice weekend – and get a Mojito or sth to relax – I will :)

Cheers

Chris

1052 posts
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chrisatlemon
says

So let me get this right: We have a club owner who comes here and tells us what he needs on his flyers for his club.

Then we turn around and say: no, that’s not what you need. You need your flyers the way we did them! We have many years of design experience, therefore we know much better than you what you need for your club.

Really?

Personally I would love to have corporate ID and stationary customers come here and tell me exactly what they want on their items so I can create better items which are more useful for my customers. I would find this information invaluable! Companies pay for this sort of information. Target groups, test groups et cetera.

But here we actually have people argue that the customer, who is an experienced buyer here, is wrong in what is asking for his business?

I find that astounding!

Cheers

Chris

1052 posts
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chrisatlemon
says

@nico: I’m not sure you read my comment right.

I’m sure that 12 years of graphic design experience didn’t teach you that 6pt fonts on business cards are a good idea? in fact I would argue you would have learnt the opposite.

If you then sell a business card with a 6pt font because it looks pretty in the preview image you are not doing this because of what you learned “in the field”. You are doing it because you think ( maybe correctly so ) that you will sell more of your business cards because it looks better On the preview image than the business card which actually has readable font sizes.

So you are doing it from what you learnt here at GR, not what you learnt from designing in the “real world”! Any real-world customer would look at your design and tell you to increase the font size.

in any case, again I don’t understand why we are arguing this. Are we trying to tell the customer what he should like? Because we’ve learnt so many tricks in photo shop he has to like them?

Wasn’t it Steve Jobs who said: design is only good if somebody actually uses it.

Cheers

Chris

1052 posts
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chrisatlemon
says

@bigtrini76 – thank you so much for this valuable information. I don’t even know why people are discussing this. What you say should be the only thing all of us should be interested in. How can we make a great item for the people who aactually buy our designs? In fact I think your comments have been some of the most valuable input I’ve seen in all the time I participate here . We should pay you for your feedback, not argue it!!

I think you make a really good point: so much here is really pretty to look at but of no use in the real world.

I am not a flyer designer, so I speak without bias here. I mainly concentrate on corporate IDs and stationery. I do this for one main reason:

In a stationary item I can include an invoice which a real-world customer can actually use, I can include business cards which a real-world customer can actually use, I can include letterheads which a real-world customer can actually use etc etc – because they are all part of one corporate ID package.

If I just submitted business cards, I’d have to make them all flashy and colourful To make them stand out from the rest. If I just sold letterheads or invoices I’d have to add all sorts of colours and icons and fancy layouts so it would get approved as a unique and detailed item.

But which company would actually want to use these to represent themselves? In my experience most companies just want a clean and simple design which makes them look professional.

Another quick precise example: Most business cards here have 6pt fonts. Who can actually read that without a magnifying glass? This is because it looks much prettier on the preview mockup in small fonts, But in real life you can’t actually read anything unless you’re a 12-year-old with perfect eyesight.

Another example: many flyers have Facebook and Twitter icons. But no actual URL! What use is that? Of course it looks prettier to just have the icon. But what good is an icon on a flyer – that’s like saying: I have an email address, but I’m not gonna tell you what it is. Nonsensical!

If I look at poster walls of upcoming events in my city it’s red or black background with giant letters. No gradients, no light effects, no fancy models or clip arts etc

In all of design information is king. With many of the items here graphics are king. I think many of the event orientated authors could make a killing if they concentrated on producing usable work! Or is it really the case that many customers prefer to buy work which is unusable in the real world, but looks pretty in the preview?

Cheers

Chris

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