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Crian says

Hey Community. :-)

Right now I am working with Requiem Light by Tonehammer. It is great but restricts my work a little bit. You just are able to choose between about 15 syllabes. Is there any VSTi creating a magnificent and heroic sound of a choir, that gives you more options? (except the EWQL wordbuilder, that take a lot of RAM and CPU – too much for my little computer hehe)

Have a nice day, Crian

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PatrickAThompson says

An amazing VST that has all the bells and whistles… but low on a memory footprint…

When you find it, do let us know :)

Honestly, it depends on what you’re doing.

You can have a choir working as a choir…

Or.. you can have your choir working as an additional orchestral instrument.

If you’re trying to do the latter, (but I’d never publicly say this)... the choirs might as well be speaking gibberish. Take John Williams’ music… “Dual of the Fates” perhaps. Is it French? Is it Tattooine?? Does it REEEEEEEEEEEEEEALLY matter to the average listener? No. The vibe, emotion, orchestrations are all perfectly suited to what Williams wanted to convey – without injecting pesky understandable lyrics into the composition.

Or even music in and around Cirque Du Soleil… Yes! Some of the lyrics are in French… but the composers have admitted that some of the lyrics are absolute nonsense gibberish – because they want the audience to ‘feel’ the music vs. trying to force-feed an intelligible line to them…. all to great success… (Though they seem to be adding more and more English into their shows… bah!)

Anyhow, my point is this. If you’re using the choir as an instrument, I implore you not to use any kind of actual text or language. I find it horribly distracting when listening to the piece as a whole. If this is the case, Requiem (Pro), Liberis, and several others can be sufficient if you massage them properly.

The closest I’ve ever come to replicating an actual choir (using EWQL Symphonic Choirs + WordBuilder) was…. maybe 65% convincing. I had to hide it all under a LOT of reverb… and even then, it was in Latin :)

I’d love to hear you and others chime back in to tell us what your goal is – and maybe we can discover a new solution!!

My 2.3 cents :)

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adammonroe says

Well said Patrick; whenever I hear a choir these days I feel my eyes roll a little, as they seem to be an occasional part of the Percussion+Percussion+Horns+Staccato Strings EPIC formula. Not to say that they can’t be well used (the Williams example is a good one) but more often than not they are being thrown in to achieve a bigger sound cheaply and quickly…which is fine, but I feel like more composers could be using the full orchestral palette to achieve the same thing (Holst’s Mars?)...but then of course, you wouldn’t end up with the characteristic 2 Steps From Hell Sound sound everyone is lusting after these days.

I don’t really own too many choir patches but if I was in the market I might consider Cinesamples Voxos? Their stuff is usually pretty good.

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Crian says

Thanks for your replies!

Well, as you realized I really try to get this 2StepsFromHell Style. I also do not want to get an understandable sound just like you said – something “tattooine” would be enough. :-P The Problem is that Requiem Light’s samples very consistent. I quantized the MIDI file but still there are some samples that shound very short and staccato like “Cre” or “Do” and then there are some samples like “Rhu” “Tus” etc. which sound longer. These disturb the flow of the whole Choir. Are there any tips?

Cinesamples Voxos sounds great – would be a worth considerin investment. :) Thanks for the advice!

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PatrickAThompson says

Try layering! (I don’t have Requiem, but I’m sure there are options!)

For example: Have “Do” and “Fa” played at the same time… or if there’s an effects patch (shouts, whispers, etc..) layers those on occasionally as well. This helps make it apparent that you’ve got a choir, but sort of muddies the perception of an actual syllable. I’ve noticed that syllables like “tus” take longer in EQWL choirs and Liberis as well….

There’s a reason for this. Sing it with me.. “FA!” “TUS!” No matter how hard I try, “tus” will always take JUST a little longer to say than “fa”. The programmers of the library knew this and are keeping it that way for realism sake. If you need a more rhythmically-specific line, use more simple syllables (then use the longer sounds to highlight end of phrases. “Fa do ra ma i luuuuus Do la meh re ta tuuuuuuuuus”. etc…

(Just gibberish… But if, on accident, I typed out something offensive, forgive me :)

I can’t say that I’ve ever tried this… but I think it’s worth a shot.

I do think your best bet would be to upgrade to Requiem Pro… Though I don’t promise it, I imagine that “Pro” has velocity triggers to get you a deeper sampling of dynamics… Maybe even mod wheel control. This will be ESSENTIAL for getting the sound you’re after.

It all goes back to thinking about the orchestration – take the French Horn. It can do some KILLER staccato… bop.. bop.. bop… But it can also do that famous heroic “rip”. Buddle-ump! The rip, while still VERY short, will always take more time than the staccato because there are more sounds packed into it… Same thing with ‘tus’... That ’s’ on the end will drag it out every time… kinda like the F.H. rip.

Heck, that might be your solution right there… Aim for syllables that end on vowels.. (except for maybe the long A sound – bake, cake, etc – because it’s a dipthong, being made up of two sounds, “eh” and “ee”...)

I could go on and on… Just finished my coffee, so I’m rather wired right now.

I hope you’ve found some useful ideas in this long and rambling post. :)

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Crian says

Hey Patrick!

Thank you a lot for your detailed reply at first! The tipp you gave me with the combination of layering “Fas” and “Dos” for example is a great idea! I have never thought about trying this but i definitely will check this out next time. :)

Too sad I can’t record a real choir. It is unbelievable which power this can add to your track. Well – Maybe one day if Audiojungle gives me a chance, i will fullfill this dream. :-)

Wish you a good day and again, thanks for the advices! :)

PS: Coffee rocks!

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