1181 posts How's the surf doing?
  • Forum Superstar
  • Elite Author
  • Sold between 250 000 and 1 000 000 dollars
  • United Kingdom
  • Referred between 200 and 499 users
  • Exclusive Author
  • Has been a member for 3-4 years
+2 more
tommusrhodus says

This is a terrible idea, if this gets put through then I think TF is going to go through a very rough patch soon. As Kreisi said, we can all now add WooCommerce versions of our themes, and the ones that have WooCommerce, we can release a “light” version of. My theme library can now double / triple once you factor in BuddyPress, BBPress etc.

Double & triple dipping items is how a marketplace becomes overrun, confusing for buyers, and basically turns into a free-for-all in my opinion.

57 posts
  • Elite Author
  • Sold between 100 000 and 250 000 dollars
  • Exclusive Author
  • Has been a member for 3-4 years
  • Europe
  • Referred between 10 and 49 users
  • Bought between 10 and 49 items
maarcin says

So if I will be able to sell e.g. WooCommerce version of standard theme here as a separate file it also means I can put it elsewhere without violating license agreements even if I’m exclusive author right? At the end these are two different themes.

372 posts
  • Bought between 100 and 499 items
  • Exclusive Author
  • Has been a member for 5-6 years
WPWiseOwl says

So if I will be able to sell e.g. WooCommerce version of standard theme here as a separate file it also means I can put it elsewhere without violating license agreements even if I’m exclusive author right? At the end these are two different themes.

Um, no. Since Envato doesn’t offer the ability to change the exclusivity status of each item, you’re either “exclusive” with Envato or you’re not. Exclusivity applies your entire account rather any individual item. If you have multiple accounts though that’s a different story, I suppose.

385 posts
  • Elite Author
  • Sold between 250 000 and 1 000 000 dollars
  • Has been a member for 4-5 years
  • United Kingdom
  • Referred between 100 and 199 users
  • Bought between 10 and 49 items
  • Exclusive Author
EugeneO says

Um, no. Since Envato doesn’t offer the ability to change the exclusivity status of each item, you’re either “exclusive” with Envato or you’re not. Exclusivity applies your entire account rather any individual item. If you have multiple accounts though that’s a different story, I suppose.
The point maarcin was making is that if you can upload two separate versions of the same file here on the marketplace, as far as Envato is concerned, they are independent items (otherwise why sell them as separate items). Therefore an author could sell one version here and another version somewhere else because they are not the same.

So the argument is either: a.) They are not the same. Authors can sell different version of the same theme here and elsewhere.

b.) They are the same and there should only be one “version” of an item with everything included.

372 posts
  • Bought between 100 and 499 items
  • Exclusive Author
  • Has been a member for 5-6 years
WPWiseOwl says

For me, there is no question the two themes can be different (i.e. not the same) unless they’re absolutely identical. Envato will ultimately set the rules for what constitutes enough difference during review. Otherwise, why offer them separately? Uploading the exact same, unmodfied theme “twice” is pointless indeed. If this happens, hard rejection will surely follow (at least). I’m certainly not an advocate of that practice. EugeneO, I believe the argument you’ve highlighted is too representative of a Straw man to be taken seriously.

How would the mere offering of two distinctly different (not the same) / separate versions of any theme suddenly mean you can ignore any already existing exclusivity deal obligations with Envato which would apply to all products approved / sold through your account? It wouldn’t. So, offering either item outside the marketplace would still constitute a breach.

I’m definitely a fan of having multiple choices rather than not being given any / only getting one.

57 posts
  • Elite Author
  • Sold between 100 000 and 250 000 dollars
  • Exclusive Author
  • Has been a member for 3-4 years
  • Europe
  • Referred between 10 and 49 users
  • Bought between 10 and 49 items
maarcin says

EugeneO nailed it.

WPWiseOwl You should read FAQ again. Exclusivity means that you can’t sell the same item elsewhere. Eg. You have theme1 and theme2. You are exclusive author and You can sell theme1 here and theme2 elsewhere without loosing exclusivity. You can’t sell theme1 here and in other market (same with theme2).

And if Envato will accept second version (eCommerce) it should be treated as a different item.

Well, from what I can tell based on items here, advanced WooCommerce support can be done with creating couple custom templates for shop and couple custom functions.

I’ll repeat myself: if eCommerce version will be accepted it will be treated as a different item (like html and wp are), so it can be sold elsewhere.

372 posts
  • Bought between 100 and 499 items
  • Exclusive Author
  • Has been a member for 5-6 years
WPWiseOwl says

LOL. Too funny. I get it now. You two are getting hung up on the word “same” literally. The mere fact that it’s no longer the “same” item anymore doesn’t suddenly exempt anyone’s account from it’s existing exclusivity state. “All” items approved on an exclusive account should be assumed to be exclusive unless officially told otherwise . There is simply no empirical evidence to support the alternative. This is unless you want to attempt to exploit a potentially non exisitant loophole or pretend that such an exception exists simply because it’s not expressly stated otherwise.

For now, I’d just say let’s just agree to disagree until the powers that be step in to let us know what’s what with their definitive words. :-)

35 posts I don't talk much.
  • Exclusive Author
  • Elite Author
  • Sold between 250 000 and 1 000 000 dollars
  • Most Wanted Bounty Winner
  • Contributed a Tutorial to a Tuts+ Site
  • Author had a Free File of the Month
  • Referred between 200 and 499 users
+3 more
kubasto says

Luckily, Collis is back and will straighten this up in a moment. He won’t let the marketplace to be undermined like that. Uff :)

385 posts
  • Elite Author
  • Sold between 250 000 and 1 000 000 dollars
  • Has been a member for 4-5 years
  • United Kingdom
  • Referred between 100 and 199 users
  • Bought between 10 and 49 items
  • Exclusive Author
EugeneO says

Although I do believe Maarcin’s point could be easily argued it was not my argument. I was simply clarifying it for, WPWiseOwl, as you misunderstood it. And in my post I did not mean “the same” in the literal sense. I meant “the same” by Envato’s own definition of what constitutes an individual item on the marketplace.

The change in rule blurs lines that up until now were very clearly defined.

127 posts
  • Elite Author
  • Sold between 250 000 and 1 000 000 dollars
  • Exclusive Author
  • Referred between 50 and 99 users
  • Bought between 1 and 9 items
  • Has been a member for 1-2 years
Cubell says

After reading through a lot of this thread, if I understand correctly – Envato are now going to allow having separate items for the same product but with/without extra compatibility/integration of some plugins? If so then I have to say I don’t think it’s a good idea. I believe something like this will cause more damage/problems to the marketplace than good.

The proper way for a theme to be sold at different price points (versions) is to do it within the same item page and having multiple options, similar to how regular license/extended license do it, but even then I’d still disagree with that as we are talking about a measly $10 difference for a theme with all 3 major plugins compatibility vs one without it. Do we really want to have $45, $50, $55 versions/options for the same theme?

I also don’t think we can use “buyers shouldn’t be forced to spend more on a theme because it has X feature” as a reason, because that to me is flawed logic. No one is forcing a buyer to spend anything, if they want a product and that product costs X because it has X features, then that is the cost of the product. We are selling stock products, it makes sense that a lot of features will not be used by every buyer. If a user bought it at that X price, it’s because they think the product is worth X. If not, they wouldn’t have bought it and would’ve looked for something else.

But if Helen’s results are anything to go by here: http://notes.envato.com/trend-spotting/pressnomics-special-latest-wordpress-trends-revealed/ only 10% or less of buyers here consider price a deciding factor.

by
by
by
by
by
by